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Post by Dutch on Apr 6, 2013 17:32:33 GMT -5
There has been, generally, little bickering here and not over what species one chooses to hunt. Discussion, yes. That is what we are doing here, discussing the potential of the WPRA's. Some think there is potential, others aren't so sure.
And this IS a different sort of message board. Spend some time here and you'll see. Lots of good folks here. Folks that, due to some changes, appreciate and consider the other persons viewpoint.
I'll do a crowing count with Lynn, if it can be arranged, but, I'm about 2 hours away, which is tough to do.
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Post by Fldbred on Apr 6, 2013 17:48:44 GMT -5
Fair enough! I know a lot of good people that just don't bother with message boards because of all the nonsense, and I know you understand what I mean.
I think you will be impressed if can do that crowing count with Lynn. It's really amazing what is happening with the pheasant program.Recently I witnessed literally dozens of WILD pheasants leave their roosts to feed across a road...it just as well could have been 1969! And this was by a farm that had NEVER received any birds.
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Post by Dutch on Apr 6, 2013 17:54:41 GMT -5
No, or little, nonsense or drama here, thats for sure.
Ok, what county were you in when you saw those birds?
Was it in a WPRA?
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Post by Fldbred on Apr 6, 2013 18:00:46 GMT -5
Yes, that particular farm was in a WPRA!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2013 18:16:22 GMT -5
We have our differences but we have all been treated unfairly by another message board because we weren't in the clique, and are striving for something different. We aren't what we have been painted as. I have not had a problem with any member here. If we can get along just fine here it shows you we weren't much of a problem elsewhere!
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Post by Fldbred on Apr 6, 2013 18:24:11 GMT -5
I hear you Stroupy!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2013 18:28:39 GMT -5
I hope you do have success How are the pheasants doing in the Gratz area? I don't live too far from there.
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Post by Fldbred on Apr 6, 2013 18:48:25 GMT -5
I don't have my finger on the pulse there as much, but from talking to the people that do, they are VERY impressed. The birds are increasing and spreading to areas where they were not released. Remember this area DID NOT receive birds last year as planned.
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Post by Dutch on Apr 6, 2013 18:54:41 GMT -5
Is there an estimated population density for the WPRA in Montour?
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Post by Fldbred on Apr 6, 2013 19:43:36 GMT -5
That can be a little tricky, obviously the density in the 50 acre field where the 170 pheasants were flushed is outstanding. But the birds seem to be in clusters, so they will know more after the crowing counts. Everyone seems to be VERY happy with the hens per square mile after the recent flushing surveys there.
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Post by Roosterslammer on Apr 7, 2013 20:35:58 GMT -5
We will have a wild pheasant hunting area here. We had a setback with the original grass mixes not providing winter cover. We are working to correct that deficiency but it takes time, effort and money. Since most of you here have provided none of the above, your complaints and doom and gloom forecasts have little influence on this project.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2013 10:35:17 GMT -5
We will have a wild pheasant hunting area here. We had a setback with the original grass mixes not providing winter cover. We are working to correct that deficiency but it takes time, effort and money. Since most of you here have provided none of the above, your complaints and doom and gloom forecasts have little influence on this project. Nice. A poster with an axe to grind.
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Post by Dutch on Apr 8, 2013 12:26:55 GMT -5
We will have a wild pheasant hunting area here. We had a setback with the original grass mixes not providing winter cover. We are working to correct that deficiency but it takes time, effort and money. Since most of you here have provided none of the above, your complaints and doom and gloom forecasts have little influence on this project. Lynn, many of us have our own pet projects and hobbies. We sink time and money into them. This is a project where public hunting license dollars are being used, on private lands, and we just want answers to questions. Like I said, Pike Run went under, looks like Somerset might do the same, I don't know? But, we can ask questions, just as I did of Carl Roe the other week when I wanted to know about the PGC expenditures on this project. Over the years, just less than $2 million spent by the PGC. I think we have a right to try to better understand this project, that's all. I see the last report on the PGC website listed 14 hens per sq mile, IIRC. What was the 2012 estimate? Are we increasing or holding our own?
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Post by bud16057 on Apr 8, 2013 13:08:13 GMT -5
Yesterday at 9:35pm, Roosterslammer wrote: We will have a wild pheasant hunting area here. We had a setback with the original grass mixes not providing winter cover. We are working to correct that deficiency but it takes time, effort and money. Since most of you here have provided none of the above, your complaints and doom and gloom forecasts have little influence on this project. Nice. A poster with an axe to grind. +1, an attitude like this makes it that much harder to be supportive of the program.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2013 13:43:06 GMT -5
This is a message board open to debate! Gotta say you aren't gonna get any money from me with that attitude. Change our minds with facts.
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Post by Dutch on Apr 8, 2013 14:36:32 GMT -5
Here are some facts:
There were no wild birds at Montour previous to these efforts.
There are now.
These guy have done well and are learning a great deal. Lynn told me when I saw him, that they need a greater switchgrass component in their warm season grass fields, and told me how they're now increasing that, simply. I wish they would have known then, what they know now. It is something of a "setback", and it will take a number of years to increase the switch.
The switchgrass is a key component due to it providing GREAT winter cover and nesting cover.
The program still has unanswered questions, but then, anything new does.
I still view this as an island and don't think these birds can expand outward very much due to the lack of habitat.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2013 15:00:38 GMT -5
Here are some facts: There were no wild birds at Montour previous to these efforts. There are now. These guy have done well and are learning a great deal. Lynn told me when I saw him, that they need a greater switchgrass component in their warm season grass fields, and told me how they're now increasing that, simply. I wish they would have known then, what they know now. It is something of a "setback", and it will take a number of years to increase the switch. The switchgrass is a key component due to it providing GREAT winter cover and nesting cover. The program still has unanswered questions, but then, anything new does. I still view this as an island and don't think these birds can expand outward very much due to the lack of habitat. That's how it's done. This in your face stuff makes me want to dig my heels in deeper.
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Post by Dutch on Apr 8, 2013 15:09:47 GMT -5
Once planted, it takes 3 years for switchgrass to fully develop.
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Post by richg on Apr 8, 2013 17:26:26 GMT -5
I have to admit,I didn't feel like doing the research but here's a question.If I remember right the price of fur went down about the same time the pheasants started disappearing.Also when did all the protection come about with the owls and hawks?Other then habitat there's alot more predators chasing the pheasants. Don't get me wrong,in my opinion back in the day nothing could beat good "cockbird" hunting. I'd also like to see more put toward grouse habitat.But that would mean a whole lot more cutting.
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Post by Dutch on Apr 8, 2013 18:13:24 GMT -5
Rich, do you remember the cornfields we hunted back then? They had weeds in them. Weeds meant seeds, seeds meant food, and the weeds gave even more cover. Then, they used to pick corn, not chop it for the silo. We had bent over corn stalks and the pickers weren't very efficient, so, we had waste corn on the ground.
Now, as I drive thru Lancaster County, I see no habitat that would support birds. There just is no cover out there, and no food.
Yes, we had fewer predators, and I have always believed that predators should not get a "pass", but there is nothing anyone can do about that.
The pheasants up in Montour seem to be growing in numbers, and reproducing decently.
Will we see 1960's pheasant populations again? Never.
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Post by Roosterslammer on Apr 8, 2013 19:29:55 GMT -5
I really feel bad about being so hard on you guys who are just really searching for knowledge . I can see our funding dropping with every word. Good one This is not about a difference of opinion. This is forming of an opinion with a lack of knowledge or misinformation. I didn't login here because there was a search for knowledge. It was because there was a host of misinformation. Dutch, the lack of switchgrass is from the NRCS. I tried to convince them that we needed to plant patches of switchgrass when we did our CREP and they said no. Diversity is the key. We had one farmer who bucked the system and planted all switch. Now we can prove the value of switchgrass and wild birds in PA. It doesn't matter if we can't do it in the whole state. We' re happy with 3 or 4.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2013 19:45:19 GMT -5
I really feel bad about being so hard on you guys who are just really searching for knowledge . I can see our funding dropping with every word. Good one This is not about a difference of opinion. This is forming of an opinion with a lack of knowledge or misinformation. I didn't login here because there was a search for knowledge. It was because there was a host of misinformation. Dutch, the lack of switchgrass is from the NRCS. I tried to convince them that we needed to plant patches of switchgrass when we did our CREP and they said no. Diversity is the key. We had one farmer who bucked the system and planted all switch. Now we can prove the value of switchgrass and wild birds in PA. It doesn't matter if we can't do it in the whole state. We' re happy with 3 or 4. I don't know anything on this subject you come on here and are lacking in the respect department and I have no interest in it now because of your attitude. Here's your chance to gain some support and quite frankly you are blowing it.
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Post by Roosterslammer on Apr 8, 2013 19:49:02 GMT -5
If you gents are up for it, I'm happy with moving ahead on a more civil format. I am a little touchey on the subject as I have spent years of time, money and effort on this project. I have better things to do than waste my time on a program without a future. I am always willing to give info when requested as i have done dozens of times to those who seek information.
Dutch, the wild pheasant plan called for a number of releases in different habitats to test where birds might survive and thrive. The fact that we have some failures is to be expected. Pike Run was never a high priority pick but the PGC failed to fund the original plan which included PPL and Blue Marsh as other areas. Pike Run was the only option as the Mellon Foundation was willing to fund it being in the Pittsburgh area. Even though Pike Run failed, we could have never tried other places without moving ahead with Pike Run. It was a necessary stepping stone. Step one of the plan is complete. We know what we need to do. Step two is getting it done. It will take years. In the mean time, people can hunt game farm birds. Wild birds will never meet the demand as wild trout can never meet the demand but it's good having some wild trout waters. Those who say game preserves can meet the demand to hunt wild pheasants have never hunted wild pheasants. WILD means alot.
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Post by Roosterslammer on Apr 8, 2013 19:56:56 GMT -5
Stroupy, there is some history here with a few of the posters from other forums. I have done nothing but provide them with info and they keep bringing up the same issues. It didn't work at the old place anymore so it continued here. I didn't appreciate it. Sorry you got hit with some of shrapnel. Lord give patience because if you give me strength, I'm going to need bail money to go with it
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Post by Dutch on Apr 8, 2013 20:20:27 GMT -5
Stroupy, there is some history here with a few of the posters from other forums. I have done nothing but provide them with info and they keep bringing up the same issues. It didn't work at the old place anymore so it continued here. I didn't appreciate it. I've never seen the explanation about Pike Run.
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