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Post by bud16057 on Apr 19, 2014 6:49:04 GMT -5
Has anyone used one of these? I bought one a few days ago, I'm hoping to try some of the ammo I've checked out with it later today. I was going to test ammo that I've trued up vs some I've reloaded that hasn't been for a test. I've been quite happy with what I've seen so far, most of my reloads are pretty concentric to begin with, I've haven't found too many that are too far out of spec. I'm hoping this might help solve the problem of the occasional flyer I get. Just wondering if anyone else out there had any experience with this or any of the other concentricity tools/gauges.
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Post by davet on Apr 19, 2014 8:06:53 GMT -5
I have a Sinclair Concentricity Gauge that I use. I measure my 6.5x55 reloads and separate them into groups of less that .001 (One thousand) the second is .005 (Two to Five thousand) and finally .006 and over.
Now, I will tell you than you probably won't notice much difference when shooting the various reloads at 100 yards. But where you will notice a difference is at 200 yards, and when you shoot them at 300 yards you will notice a definite difference.
I have found that concentricity is only one point for good long range reloads. However, consistent neck tension on each piece of brass, trimming all of the brass to the same length is a must, and check to ensure your brass necks don't develop the "brass bulge" that can and does happen. I have a case neck inside reamer that cut's out the brass build up so the brass that has been fired several times will get back a consistent full neck tension.
Dave
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Post by bawanajim on Apr 19, 2014 8:41:58 GMT -5
If you weigh your cases before reloading and separate into lots by weight most of your inconsistencies will disappear.
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Post by davet on Apr 19, 2014 8:49:46 GMT -5
If you weigh your cases before reloading and separate into lots by weight most of your inconsistencies will disappear. At what distance are you doing your group shootings at? Dave |
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Post by bawanajim on Apr 19, 2014 8:55:06 GMT -5
Five hundred yards, but mostly 3-4, what I have found is when I buy new cases before I do any thing with them I weigh them and find the irregularities that way and in the end it saves me loading and shooting cases that are not up to my standards.
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Post by davet on Apr 19, 2014 11:43:01 GMT -5
New cases are fantastic. I buy Norma or Lapua brass because when you actually do the math on the number of reloads you get per piece of brass, the cost per piece of brass is less with the higher quality brass vs. buying Winchester or Rem. Now, that's true with the 6.5 Swede. I can't speak of other bottle neck cartridges. For my .223 I have found that it doesn't really matter...for that caliber what seems to matter the most is trim to length, primer, and the most important is powder and the "very most" important is bullet. Seating depth doesn't seem to make all that much difference in the .223. Now, my buddy will tend to differ with my opinion on that....but our .223 groups are both pretty consistent and not any closer or farther apart.
The larger caliber's seem to make a difference.
If I had unlimited resources I would buy Lapua and Norma brass, shoot 'em once and toss 'em. The first shot using these products just give incredible groups.
FWIW
Dave
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Post by bawanajim on Apr 19, 2014 12:57:53 GMT -5
Dave have you tried just neck sizing in 6.5? The Nosler bullets are fantastic, and I use magnum primers for consistency in large capacity cases, yet I want once fired cases when the chips are down.
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Post by davet on Apr 19, 2014 13:20:22 GMT -5
Dave have you tried just neck sizing in 6.5? The Nosler bullets are fantastic, and I use magnum primers for consistency in large capacity cases, yet I want once fired cases when the chips are down. Jim, Yes. I've gone overboard on my 6.5. Way...overboard. Now.....just to back up a bit, I did buy the action new and then I purchased a Shilen hunting barrel that is WOW accurate for the first three shots. Of course then heat takes over. So, then I purchased another bull barrel Shilen (same caliber of 6.5 Swede) for just bench plinking (is there such a thing?...well for me there is!!) and long range groundhog shooting. With the Savage action and the barrel nut, plus headspace gauges it's pretty easy to swap barrels. But....back to your question, yes...I use a Redding Competition bushing neck sizer die, and when needed I use a Redding Body Die to bump back the shoulder to just give my brass a few thousands of needed headspace. Now, this was a little Backwards, but I ended up buying and using an RCBS competition seating die. And this die works just fine. So....am I over the edge with this? Well....I "practice" at a farm shooting groundhogs from 400 to 800 yards. It's an unusual set up at this place as we can sit on one side of a wide valley and shoot across to the other side. It's way back and we shoot well above one dirt road that has little if any traffic. Shooting mats and 24X scopes, tripods and MOA's is the name of the game, and we (usually three of us) do have a good time. One of the best parts for me is, since I can't take the sun...is there is a set of trees that provides a great shade. So, we get a nice breeze under the shade and in the early part of the day, or late evening....it's just great!! Dave |
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Post by bawanajim on Apr 19, 2014 21:09:29 GMT -5
A friend of mine has a shop here, if you get a hankerin for more "fun stuff" he likely can help you out, he's one of this countries best, and a great guy. Neil Jones, and his company is Custom products, good stuff. www.neiljones.com/ |
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Post by davet on Apr 20, 2014 9:07:09 GMT -5
He's located up by my Aunt 'n a few cousin's of mine. When I was a kid I spent many a summer up there. I have the most fondest of memories in that part of Pa. Just a great place to be a kid.
Thanks for the link. I may call him.
Dave
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Post by bawanajim on Apr 20, 2014 9:15:37 GMT -5
Neil is a cantankerous ole fart, but the most knowledgeable gun smith I have ever met, I can spend hours listening to him talk rifles, he lives to help people out with any kind of accuracy issues you may have.
Its been a fantastic weekend, we don't have the best of weather but this area makes up for it with things to do, right now the spring flowers are blooming and the crappies are biting, blue birds are nesting and yesterday the tree swallows came back, yea Dave I too love it here.
Have a great Easter, Jim
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Post by bud16057 on Apr 20, 2014 9:41:43 GMT -5
Dave & Jim- thanks for the replies and info. Got to do some shooting yesterday, results seemed to vary. Just need to keep tinkering at this, I have a few places I can shoot groundhogs at 4-500 yards. My goal is to be able to consistently hit them at that distance.
Jim- you mentioned weighing cases. How do you sort yours? How much of a weight variation per lot to you allow? Do you use a beam or electronic scale? Right now I just have a beam scale, I've been debating about getting a digital one, but they all seem to get such varied reviews. (One guy loves model "x", next guy says its junk ) I haven't been able to decide what one to get.
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Post by bawanajim on Apr 20, 2014 10:02:23 GMT -5
Electronic scales, I use them for nothing more than comparison, for actual weights I use beam scales as they leave little to chance.
As for the amount of difference it all depends on case size and weights, a belted 378 case is going to have a greater degree of variance than a 243 win, case.
Start with 100 cases, put one on the scale and hit zero, then weigh the 100 and remove the worst 10% if that does not provide the accuracy you want try 15 or 20%.
I then weigh finish loaded cases and do the same, using the culled loads foul fouling shots.
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Post by davet on Apr 20, 2014 15:33:17 GMT -5
FWIW, I have the RCBS 1500 dispenser and powder scale. Now...I just looked at this on MidwayUSA and the price has gone up since I purchased mine several years ago. Plus, I purchased just the scale first, and about a year later I bought the dispenser. Yes, that cost a little more to do it that way.....but it also spread out the cash flow. I've been very happy with the RCBS set up.
Dave
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Post by bghunter on May 13, 2014 18:54:49 GMT -5
I to shoot .264 bullets from my Cmoor and had a friend test my loaded rounds one day at club. He had bought a Hornady Con. Ga. and found my rounds within what he thought good. That's as far as I ever got into it. As for good brass I use Hornaday brass for when I built rifle they were the only brass makers at the time. Hornady brass IMO anyways is beautiful not one bad word from me. I too shoot longer ranges 1,2, and 300 for paper groups. G/hogs 400 and out. Almost same set up shoot across a valley to other hill with shots to 700yds. I shoot 120gr. Nosler bullets. I have found with a Crony the SD is what turns me on for my loads are all below .10 Just seems to matter to me. I load with Hornady dies and love them the sizer die is a bushing die very well made die IMO My feelings are if the brass weight is alittle off then so be it . At the long range if the brass is why I missed a 2nd shot is a hit most times. At 600yds a g/hog don't know what it was unless you dust him!!!! No one knows why or can come up with a reason for a flyer we all get them. Slow shooting bench work cool barrel has been my motto. When I need a tight tight group at bench I shoot with an egg timer to keep barrel as cool as I can. I've read where guys keep their ammo in a cooler while g/hog hunting so powder stays at a good temp. while hunting?  Guess we can drive ourselves nuts with perfection at times. I too like sitting in shade on a lawn chair it's the best..... |
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Guess we can drive ourselves nuts with perfection at times. I too like sitting in shade on a lawn chair it's the best.....