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Post by ridgecommander on Mar 18, 2024 15:37:44 GMT -5
Well Ridge.......Doug isn't the only one who has the impression that you're always supporting the "easiest way" as that's also my impression. THat might be your impression but it is wrong. Once something is legal I support those that utilize it. If an idea or proposal is made, I do not always support its legalization, regardless of how easy or hard it might be. I do not support arrow guns in archery season. I also do not support drones to assist in hunts in real time. Those being just two of many examples. Many would argue that those make the sport easier.
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Post by davet on Mar 18, 2024 15:41:01 GMT -5
BTW and FWIW, both a Havaheart trap and a cable restraint trap are considered live traps.
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Post by dougl on Mar 18, 2024 17:12:29 GMT -5
Of course ethics are subjective but you always support the easiest way.As soon as someone disagrees with you,they're pounding their chest. Again, you are mischaracterizing my position. I do not always support the easiest way. Once it is legal, I then support the hunters that utilize those techniques or weapons. Up till now, I gave you the benefit of a doubt, but at this point, you are just lying. It is how one disagrees. I respect most people that disagree with me. As I have said many times, a robust but civil discussion ultimately arrives at the best outcome. Some can do it and some can't. Whatever Gene.I'm being civil and don't give a royal crap how easy you want things to be.You seemed to be OK with your buddy using a drone to scout for bears in corn fields.
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Post by ridgecommander on Mar 19, 2024 6:28:11 GMT -5
Whatever Gene.I'm being civil and don't give a royal crap how easy you want things to be. If being civil is purposely lying, then it has a new meaning and apparently you do give a crap cause you keep bringing it up. You made the same claim a few years ago about me "always" supporting the easiest way possible after which I explained what my actual position was. Yet, here you are repeating the same thing. I am okay with using a drone for scouting. In my opinion, there needs to be laws or regs though attached to it like Alaska has as an example where you cannot hunt the same day you fly.
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Post by dougl on Mar 19, 2024 8:04:25 GMT -5
Again,you not only support easy,you promote it.I hunt the way I want Gene.I really don't care how other people choose to kill things as long as it doesn't impact me.Unlike you,I've never sent a letter or email in protest of anything?Why?Because I really don't care.Just because I don't care how other people kill stuff,doesn't mean I have to respect it or support it.It's no different than something like abortion.I look at it as murder but ultimately,it's between that person and God,not me.Therefore,I could care less.
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Post by ridgecommander on Mar 19, 2024 10:36:56 GMT -5
Again,you not only support easy,you promote it. Sometimes I do. Never denied that. I don't "always" support it despite you repeatedly claiming that I do. Anyways, till the next time you lie about my position, which most likely will come.
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Post by dougl on Mar 19, 2024 11:10:40 GMT -5
You like easy Gene.That's not a lie.
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Post by ridgecommander on Mar 19, 2024 11:31:05 GMT -5
You like easy Gene.That's not a lie. Sometimes I do for sure. With that said, that wasn't the accusation that was made. dcego still binds ya up...........
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Post by rusty on Mar 19, 2024 11:42:23 GMT -5
You like easy Gene.That's not a lie. That is the impression many hunters would get from many of your posts, Ridge. I have no problem with Crossbows for the handicapped and the aged, but healthy hunters hunting with them is used as a shortcut to success for most if not all who use them-IMHO of course.
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Post by ridgecommander on Mar 19, 2024 11:54:33 GMT -5
That is the impression many hunters would get from many of your posts, Ridge. I certainly understand that. Hunters that wholeheartedly support other legal hunters, their legal methods and different legal weapon choices are often attacked by those that feel that other techniques or methods are somehow beneath them or bad for the sport. Throw crossbows in the mix and that riles many folks up. I am quite content with the tools and techniques I use and support. Yes, I use a crossbow in archery season. I also hunt with a pistol and flintlock in rifle season sometimes. I did this year. Not many hunters who claim to not take the easy way do that. I shot over a dozen gobblers with a crossbow and a few outside of the blind, instead of using a bangstick with TSS 50 yards. Yes, some will say shooting a gobbler outside of a blind with a crossbow is as easy as a shotgun loaded with tss, but if they really believe that, they are just plain ignorant of reality. Stereotyping based on of what you want to see, instead of seeing the big picture is not an uncommon thing as evidenced by this thread. Most of us use shortcuts to success, including yourself. Instead of focusing on what other do, maybe recognize you are as guilty as others are and that would give you an appreciation of the great choices we have and the respect others deserve.
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Post by dougl on Mar 19, 2024 12:15:22 GMT -5
Whatever Gene.You like easy and I could care less.I just find it funny when guys like you try to spin it and then start throwing stones.
I do things the way I do them because it's more fun to me and more satisfying.It has nothing to do with ego but it may have something to do with respect.
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Post by dougl on Mar 19, 2024 12:19:38 GMT -5
That is the impression many hunters would get from many of your posts, Ridge. I certainly understand that. Hunters that wholeheartedly support other legal hunters, their legal methods and different legal weapon choices are often attacked by those that feel that other techniques or methods are somehow beneath them or bad for the sport. Throw crossbows in the mix and that riles many folks up. I am quite content with the tools and techniques I use and support. Yes, I use a crossbow in archery season. I also hunt with a pistol and flintlock in rifle season sometimes. I did this year. Not many hunters who claim to not take the easy way do that. I shot over a dozen gobblers with a crossbow and a few outside of the blind, instead of using a bangstick with TSS 50 yards. Yes, some will say shooting a gobbler outside of a blind with a crossbow is as easy as a shotgun loaded with tss, but if they really believe that, they are just plain ignorant of reality. Stereotyping based on of what you want to see, instead of seeing the big picture is not an uncommon thing as evidenced by this thread. Most of us use shortcuts to success, including yourself. Instead of focusing on what other do, maybe recognize you are as guilty as others are and that would give you an appreciation of the great choices we have and the respect others deserve. LOL.That's funny Gene.I personally don't focus on anything others do.However,I will respond when you post something as ridiculous as comparing a fish finder to a drone.Doing things the easiest way possible really isn't deserving of respect.I respect that it's someone's right to do within the law but you can't force me to respect the way they do it.
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Post by Loggy on Mar 19, 2024 12:23:50 GMT -5
I certainly understand that. Hunters that wholeheartedly support other legal hunters, their legal methods and different legal weapon choices are often attacked by those that feel that other techniques or methods are somehow beneath them or bad for the sport. Throw crossbows in the mix and that riles many folks up. I am quite content with the tools and techniques I use and support. Yes, I use a crossbow in archery season. I also hunt with a pistol and flintlock in rifle season sometimes. I did this year. Not many hunters who claim to not take the easy way do that. I shot over a dozen gobblers with a crossbow and a few outside of the blind, instead of using a bangstick with TSS 50 yards. Yes, some will say shooting a gobbler outside of a blind with a crossbow is as easy as a shotgun loaded with tss, but if they really believe that, they are just plain ignorant of reality. Stereotyping based on of what you want to see, instead of seeing the big picture is not an uncommon thing as evidenced by this thread. Most of us use shortcuts to success, including yourself. Instead of focusing on what other do, maybe recognize you are as guilty as others are and that would give you an appreciation of the great choices we have and the respect others deserve. LOL.That's funny Gene.I personally don't focus on anything others do.However,I will respond when you post something as ridiculous as comparing a fish finder to a drone.Doing things the easiest way possible really isn't deserving of respect.I respect that it's someone's right to do within the law but you can't force me to respect the way they do it. Fully agree Doug!! Only thing I can conclude is that Ridge musta bought himself a drone!!
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Post by dougl on Mar 19, 2024 12:26:08 GMT -5
one with auto pilot most likely
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Post by Loggy on Mar 19, 2024 12:27:57 GMT -5
one with auto pilot most likely ...plus heat seeking!
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Post by ridgecommander on Mar 19, 2024 12:27:57 GMT -5
However,I will respond when you post something as ridiculous as comparing a fish finder to a drone. Ridiculous in your mind, maybe? The thing is there is a national discussion about the evolution of electronics in both fishing and hunting. These are new times and new regulations are being discussed. You often ask "where does it end". Do you see anything in fishing as too much? And there is the difference. I respect any hunter hunting legally.
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Post by ridgecommander on Mar 19, 2024 12:31:14 GMT -5
Only thing I can conclude is that Ridge musta bought himself a drone!! Nope! Nope! Conundrums and contradictions often result in defensiveness..........
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Post by rusty on Mar 19, 2024 12:37:22 GMT -5
Ridge, would you support a crossbow season sperate from an archery season that was limited to weapons that have to be drawn manually in the presence of game so that, if one of the weapons is found to have a much higher rate of success, it's season could be shortened?
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Post by dougl on Mar 19, 2024 13:16:33 GMT -5
Ridiculous in your mind, maybe? The thing is there is a national discussion about the evolution of electronics in both fishing and hunting. These are new times and new regulations are being discussed. You often ask "where does it end". Do you see anything in fishing as too much?
I could care less about technology with fishing because you have the option of releasing them.I obviously would support something like gill nets.
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Post by dougl on Mar 19, 2024 13:17:51 GMT -5
Hunting has become an attention seeking activity where people compete.To me,that takes away from the true meaning and making easier and easier only makes it worse.
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Post by ridgecommander on Mar 19, 2024 13:20:19 GMT -5
Ridge, would you support a crossbow season sperate from an archery season that was limited to weapons that have to be drawn manually in the presence of game so that, if one of the weapons is found to have a much higher rate of success, it's season could be shortened? As of now, no. If something changed, I would be happy to look at the numbers as an objective person. Present data from now and in the past shows that crossbows have not negatively affected the resource, season length or success in other seasons. Most data shows crossbows enjoy a success rate difference of 2-8% versus vertical equipment. The real difference is between tradiotnal and crossbow/vertical. Pa has one of the highest numbers of archery hunters in the country and our archery seasons have been expanded and most evidence shows a growing deer herd. Yes, even with crossbow inclusion.
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Post by ridgecommander on Mar 19, 2024 13:27:24 GMT -5
Hunting has become an attention seeking activity where people compete.. I would agree that has become the case with many. That is part of the reason why I stepped away from outdoor writing. Now I hunt for myself whereas before there was pressure to accomplish something for others and pressure can lead to poor decisions and a poor hunting experience.
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Post by dougl on Mar 20, 2024 8:36:42 GMT -5
Ridge, would you support a crossbow season sperate from an archery season that was limited to weapons that have to be drawn manually in the presence of game so that, if one of the weapons is found to have a much higher rate of success, it's season could be shortened? As of now, no. If something changed, I would be happy to look at the numbers as an objective person. Present data from now and in the past shows that crossbows have not negatively affected the resource, season length or success in other seasons. Most data shows crossbows enjoy a success rate difference of 2-8% versus vertical equipment. The real difference is between tradiotnal and crossbow/vertical. Pa has one of the highest numbers of archery hunters in the country and our archery seasons have been expanded and most evidence shows a growing deer herd. Yes, even with crossbow inclusion. That's very subjective data.When you look at it on an idividual basis,the success rate is much higher with crossbows.I know quite a few hunters who rarely if ever killed deer with a compound but consistently started killing them once they switched to a crossbow.There's probably isn't much difference with the guys who were consistently successful with a compound and then switched.I look back at when my son started using a crossbow at 8.He used it for 3 years and I can't remember him missing or wounding a single deer.Several of those deer I would have passed with my compound.
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Post by ridgecommander on Mar 20, 2024 10:57:26 GMT -5
That's very subjective data.When you look at it on an idividual basis,the success rate is much higher with crossbows. Actually, if you are referring to success rates it is objective data that I was referring to. When I was lobbying for crossbows, I had hard data from several different states regarding success rates. That was the data That is a good example of subjective or anecdotal.
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Post by dougl on Mar 20, 2024 11:05:26 GMT -5
The percent of the harvest went way up since crossbows were introduced.That happened because they're far easier and far more effective.Nothing subjective about that.That's all despite what many claim as them being heavy,cumbersome and harder to use in a treestand.
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